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beltmann · Posted: 10.13.2003 3:09 am Post subject:

Yeah, access (or the lack of it for most of us) is my pet peeve when it comes to studying cinema. After years of trolling video stores, rummage sales, and the back rooms of libraries, I've managed to see an awful lot of "obscure" stuff, but not nearly as much as I would like. I joined Netflix more than 3 years ago, and despite my occasional frustrations regarding their stocking policies, it's still the best way to find stuff in bulk that I've encountered. Many of those I listed above are carried by Netflix (a few I even saw through them myself).

Eric

beltmann · Posted: 10.13.2003 3:10 am Post subject:

By the way, Al, welcome. Glad you decided to join us!

Eric

Al · Grip Joined: 13 Oct 2003 Posts: 10

Thanks Eric! I'm a huge movie fan but have never studied film. Just sort of watch things that I find interesting and enjoy wandering down new artistic paths, so to speak. Often I find myself enjoying films but not being able to articulate what I find "special" about them, because I have no frame of reference for discussion other than having seen a lot of movies Very Happy

(compared to average folks, not you all).

But, this thread isn't about me, so I have a few other KB thoughts...

1) I was reading a review (now I can't find it online) that compared (only superficially) the Crazy 88 fight and the Battle with the Agent Smiths in Matrix:Reloaded. As I rewatched KB I was really reminded again how much that whole Reloaded sequence bothered me... And THAT reminded me of the first time I saw CGI subbed in for actors in a fight, which was in Blade II, which (predictably) also rubbed me the wrong way. Basically, if I wanted to watch computer figures fight I'd fire up the PC/playstation, whatever. With human subjects (even with wire or SFX assistance) it's an impressive display that stimulates the imagination by showing real people accomplish the impossible. With CGI anything is possible for a price... I think that the CGI is better used bringing impossible large scale sequences to life (LOR:TT and RTK?) or creating otherwise impossible characters (The Hulk, Gollum, etc.).

2) The cinematic, spectacular quality of the action/violence shouldn't be dismissed (not that people have been dismissing this as just another action flick)... I read a review on MSN's Slate (haven't figured out links in posts yet, sorry) where the reviewer said at the end that this is the movie that Robert Rodriguez has been trying to make but hasn't pulled off yet. I totally agree with that comment. Once Upon A Time In Mexico was definetly a fun movie, but it didn't have that "special" quality to the action that KB has (for all of it's slow motion attempts.....).

Al

Mark Dujsik · Posted: 10.13.2003 6:52 am Post subject:

The Third M?n · Posted: 10.13.2003 7:32 am Post subject:

You see, I'm planning to sneak on with a bunch of friends this Friday to see Kill Bill. Since it's an 18 here, meaning that no-one below that age is permitted to see it, my friends and I are going to get tickets for someting else and then we'll go to Kill Bill's screening. I've never done this before, but hopefully it works... I'm dying to see it!

Al · Grip Joined: 13 Oct 2003 Posts: 10

[quote="Mark Dujsik]I think the Neo vs. multiple Smiths sequence needed CG to make it work, because it is a large scale battle that requires "impossible" characters (an overwhelming number of the same character in this case). That sequence didn't depend solely on CG either and also used split screen and stunt doubles to great effect.[/quote]

I definetly agree that the scene couldn't have been created as it was without CG. I suppose I should clarify what effects in particular I didn't like... The substitution of 3D CG characters for "primary" actors is what bothers me I think. If a character is CG throughout the film, great. If CG is used to create legions of fighters for a battle, great. If you sneak in a CG "stunt double" that you're showing close up, it bothers me.

I'm definetly not opposed to CG in movies and I'm as excited as anyone about the possibilites that they open up creatively. I know that it's not just a "cop out" of things that could be done with photographic techniques and that CG is an art form in and of itself. What can I say, I find seeing the hero replaced for half second bursts with a 3D model unappealing... To zero in on it, I think that I dislike it specifically when it's used to replace people... Don't know why, but it just sticks in my craw... (There's an expression for ya! Very Happy

I think they said that in Open Range...)

Al

Mark Dujsik · Posted: 10.13.2003 11:46 pm Post subject:

the night watchman · Posted: 10.14.2003 1:23 am Post subject:

matt header · Posted: 10.14.2003 2:37 am Post subject:

When I watched "Kill Bill" here in Milwaukee a couple days ago, the audience was generally really good: not talkative but really into it, enhancing the energy and even applauding at the end (I love it when audiences do that). There was one audience moment I will never forget, though; when the Bride is at the House of Blue Leaves during the monster fight scene, there's a moment when she kills about three assailants on the staircase in a matter of seconds.

Says one guy a couple rows behind me: "Damn, that was cold!"

Says the other guy sitting next to him: "Too bad."

I guess I was just caught up in the moment, but I laughed uproariously at that comment.

Danny Baldwin · Posted: 10.14.2003 3:34 am Post subject:

Michael Scrutchin · Posted: 10.14.2003 2:53 pm Post subject:

Hey, I just found this: HKFlix.com Kill Bill Study Guide. Good stuff.
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filmsRpriceless · Camera Operator Joined: 26 Jun 2003 Posts: 65

Thanks for the link, Michael!
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the night watchman · Posted: 10.15.2003 3:49 am Post subject:

So did you get in to see Kill Bill, Mr. Lime? With your knowledge of sewers it ought to have been a breeze. Wink

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"If you're talking about censorship, and what things should be shown and what things shouldn't be shown, I've said that as an artist you have no social responsibility whatsoever."

-David Cronenberg

the night watchman · Posted: 10.15.2003 3:52 am Post subject:

Ah, thanks, Michael. Here's the origin of The Bride's "flashback theme":

"Of particular note is the theme song to THE GREEN HORNET. THE GREEN HORNET, as you'll no doubt remember, was the 1966-67 TV series that co-starred the late, great Bruce Lee as Kato, the mask-adorned sidekick to The Green Hornet. This theme song is instantly recognizable by the quick succession of trumpeted staccato 16th notes that make up its melody."

Now I'll be able to sleep tonight.
_________________
"If you're talking about censorship, and what things should be shown and what things shouldn't be shown, I've said that as an artist you have no social responsibility whatsoever."

-David Cronenberg

Monkeypox · Posted: 10.15.2003 10:00 am Post subject: